Message-ID: <0ZNDXhe00VcJApKE4G@andrew.cmu.edu>
Reply-To: space+@Andrew.CMU.EDU
From: space-request+@Andrew.CMU.EDU
To: space+@Andrew.CMU.EDU
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 89 01:38:41 -0500 (EST)
Subject: SPACE Digest V10 #261

SPACE Digest                                     Volume 10 : Issue 261

Today's Topics:
				(none)
	       Re: Population pressure to move to space
	      Re: Micro-gravity fermentation experiments
		       Re: Mars space elevator
		       Re: Population pressure
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Date: 17 Nov 89 16:39:00 GMT
From: gem.mps.ohio-state.edu!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!uwm.edu!rpi!rpitsmts!forumexp@tut.cis.ohio-state.edu,
        Krugannal@andrew.cmu.edu
Subject: (none)


   >Um... wouldn't it be a lot simpler to move Phobos?
     Yea, but that is not as much fun!

------------------------------

Date: 17 Nov 89 05:12:45 GMT
From: zephyr.ens.tek.com!tektronix!sequent!mntgfx!sbiederman@uunet.uu.net  (Steve Biederman)
Subject: Re: Population pressure to move to space


    I'm tired of hearing the claim that space is the place to put our
overpopulation.  Look at the numbers for a fraction of a minute, and you see
that it just ain't so, not unless you postulate absolutely unbelievable "humans
into space" technology.

    What numbers do I mean?  The earth now has about 4 billion people, and our
population is doubling at approximately every 20 years.  Let's say it takes 20
years before a) whatever technology you advocate is mature, and b) population
pressure starts to get really fierce.  At that point, the earth is adding 8
billion people per 20 years, or over a million people a day.  

    So in order to just keep the earth's population at a steady state, you need
to be putting over a million people a day into space.  A million people a day! 
I don't think ANY of you think it's remotely likely that the technology to do
that, in a way that's less stressful on our resources than keeping the people
around, will exist anytime in the next twenty years, or the next hundred.

    Humans into space is intellectually challenging.  Humans into space is the
right thing for our species.  But it has nothing to do with easing population
pressure.

------------------------------

Date: 15 Nov 89 17:20:29 GMT
From: dsac!dsacg2!nam2254@tut.cis.ohio-state.edu  (Tom Ohmer)
Subject: Re: Micro-gravity fermentation experiments

In article <13.Nov.89.09:47:50.GMT.ZZASSGL@UK.AC.MCC.CMS>, ZZASSGL@cms.manchester-computing-centre.ac.UK writes:
>  instance, a good pub within  easy floating distance. Obviously shipping
>  casks  of beer  up from  the  surface of  the  Earth would  be much  to
>  expensive  and would  probably  ruin the  beer. Thus  one  of the  most
>  important, yet  neglected, aspects of space  research is how to  brew a
>  good beer in space.
 
A friend of mine and I are considering volunteering (hopefully with
sponsorship from Bud Light :-) for study of the long-term effects of
consumption of massive quantities of beer and Buffalo-style chicken wings
in micro-gravity!
 

-- 
Tom Ohmer @ Defense Logistics Agency Systems Automation Center,
            DSAC-AMB, Bldg. 27-6, P.O. Box 1605, Columbus, OH  43216-5002
UUCP: ...{seismo!osu-cis}!dsacg2!tohmer   INTERNET: tohmer@dsacg2.dla.mil
Phone: (614) 238-9210   AUTOVON:  850-9210   Disclaimer claimed

------------------------------

Date: 17 Nov 89 14:09:20 GMT
From: aramis.rutgers.edu!athos.rutgers.edu!masticol@rutgers.edu  (Steve Masticola)
Subject: Re: Mars space elevator

Robert Firth writes:

]]Mars has one large disadvantage too: the moon Phobos orbits within the bounds
]]of its synchronous orbit. I don't think there's any point along Mars' equator
]]that Phobos doesn't eventually pass over
...
]]This problem was discussed in Fountains
]]of Paradise by Arthur C. Clarke. The proposed solution was to set up a
]]carefully-controlled vibration in the elevator, which would cause it to
]]move out of the way as Phobos passed by.

] Um... wouldn't it be a lot simpler to move Phobos?

The only place where Phobos wouldn't still be a problem is in
synchronous orbit, or above. Which brings up the interesting
possibility of using Phobos as a base of operations in building the
elevator, and if possible as a source of raw material. Put Phobos in a
synchronous orbit and start paying out the cable. Tidal effects would
even tend to keep the cable pointed toward (or away from!) Mars as
it's paid out.

Of course, if you've got a technology that can move small moons around
when they're inconvenient, who needs space elevators?

- Steve.

------------------------------

Date: 17 Nov 89 23:36:30 GMT
From: skipper!shafer@ames.arc.nasa.gov  (Mary Shafer)
Subject: Re: Population pressure

In article <10580@maven.u.washington.edu> games@maven.u.washington.edu (Games Wizard) writes:

   Seems to me that we have forgotten the Austrailia syndrome. 

Georgia was used as a penal colony until the revolution.  Once it was
closed to the British, they started using Australia.

Makes you wonder about those old Georgia families.  :-)

   (Also used in"The Moon is a Harsh Mistress" Heinlein.  But there is
   a new twist...

I have always assumed that "The Moon Is a Harsh Mistress" was based
on Georgia, since Australia did it by attrition.

--
Mary Shafer   shafer@elxsi.dfrf.nasa.gov  ames!elxsi.dfrf.nasa.gov!shafer
         NASA Ames-Dryden Flight Research Facility, Edwards, CA
                    Of course I don't speak for NASA

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End of SPACE Digest V10 #261
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